November 3rd, 2004

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Politics
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The Exodus Begins

What with the Republican victory south of the border, it appears that some folks are considering leaving the US for kinder, gentler shores. Today, not one but two questions about moving abroad were posted to Ask MetaFilter (a kind of P2P advice site). I was surprised by two responses regarding the relative calibre of American and Canadian post-secondary institutions:

However, Canadian schools are incredibly tough as compared to those in the States. I don’t know what program you are planning to go into, but I graduated from here, took AP Calculus in high school, and I failed first year calculus in university. I’m doing much better now in my third year, but I still have to work my ass off for a 75% average (considered very decent and that’s equivalent to a 3.0 in the States).

And the second one:

As an American coming to Canada, expect to find undergraduate or graduate work challenging. Americans often have a very uneven academic backgrounds. Many are excellent, but it’s not uncommon for new undergrads to have to take pre-first year courses (”Q-year”) or new graduate students to take fourth- or even third-year undergraduate courses.

I’ve never been one to diss our educational system, but I didn’t know it was superior to the US. I suppose that it’s not really. Rather, the US has a profoundly uneven system, where the quality of education varies greatly?

UPDATE: In case you Americans wish to expatriate yourself, here’s a guide (via BoingBoing).

UPDATE #2: Tim Bray offers his perspective on coming north: “In my experience, if you’re English-speaking and can get a job and aren’t an obvious criminal or terrorist and have decent health, getting permanent residence in Canada is easy, if slow and a bit on the expensive side.”

Comments: 8 Responses so far

joke
November 3rd, 2004
9:57 am

Exactly right, Darren. Canadian education is much more homogeneous, by and large, and roughly equivalent to the big, good US state schools.
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James Bow
November 3rd, 2004
12:03 pm

I have had no complaints whatsoever with the quality of my University education.

My high school education, however… Let’s just say, when our Universities have to waste time teaching basic grammar to first year students, there’s a problem.

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Chris
November 3rd, 2004
12:13 pm

For whatever it’s worth, I know a lot of people who did well in high school, did AP calculus, and yet failed first year math. University learning is a different kind of learning than high school, and some people don’t adapt.

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Richard
November 3rd, 2004
1:02 pm

I like Americans (or at least I like my American friends), so having them move up here where I can hang out with them more easily is something I would actually like. But liberal-minded people moving to Canada would be a huge mistake. For one, that’s exactly what they want you to do, because they don’t like you.

As to the actual bulk of your entry, Darren, I can’t speak about the differences between US and Canadian state colleges, mainly because I went to a Canadian school, and because I went to SFU, which often tries to cram a year’s worth of study into one semester. (I took second-year political science courses in my second semester there.) Simon Fraser students only real comparison point is UBC, though, so I don’t know how a more traditional school (UBC) compares with traditional state colleges in the States.

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Andrea
November 3rd, 2004
3:53 pm

I used to work in PR (i.e. Sports Information) for the Athletics Department at SFU. Several of our coaches and student athletes had gone to school in the US. The athletes had generally returned to Canada because they lost their free ride for tuition when their *athletic* performance wasn’t up to snuff (at prestigious schools) or because they felt like they were taking basket-weaving (at low end schools). The coaches who’d studied in the US told me that they found Canadian coursework more challenging, except when they’d studied at big state schools or prestigious private universities. They told me that US education is incredibly lop-sided.

Many Americans are aware of this issue. That’s why TV shows like Family Ties made fun of little colleges — e.g. Alex says Mallory’s school offers a course on opening an umbrella and Skippy says, “I got an A in that.” It’s also the reason that Americans pay so much more attention to school rankings.

Also, university admission is still rigid in Canada, because private companies can’t set up universities. So you really have to have good grades to get in. That means you’re competing with a lot of bright people — and have to work harder to manage the bell curve. There are more colleges per capita in the US, so, naturally, there is greater disparity in the rigour of schools. (Mind you, does this also apply to Ontario or Nova Scotia, where there are infintismal numbers of schools?)

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Kirsten
November 3rd, 2004
4:23 pm

I’ve been fielding a few questions from my American friends about Canadian immigration, but it sure isn’t easy. (I went through the process when moving up here with my American husband.) It got me thinking, though: Canada should really try to take advantage of a potential reverse brain-drain. Right now we’ve got a shortage of doctors, and it wouldn’t be a bad idea to bolster our reputation in technology & science innovation. The US is not exactly going to be a nurturing environment for liberal academics, scientists, and so forth. Why not lower the immigration requirements for some of the more desirable job descriptions, and let Canada reap some of the benefits of the USA’s new stifling policies? Looks like a perfect match to me…

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becky
November 3rd, 2004
11:56 pm

As an ex-pat who’s been up here for a couple of years now, I’m quite happy. There’s an article about the Canadian Immigration’s reaction to the proposed exodus of American liberals here.

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Diane
July 12th, 2006
5:56 pm

So, we’ve been thinking seriously about moving to Canada within the next 5 years. First, some financial issues and stability need to be solved. But here’s the question. If not Canada, then where? We want the hell out of this country which has become a mess run by liars and thieves. I am so NOT proud to be an American, it’s hard to believe it’s come to this. ‘Thank you’ Mr. Bush, in these short years you have ruined our country and our worldwide reputation. Will we ever be able to rise above the pounding waves and breathe…and live as before? Or has he ruined it for all? I think the latter…and so I ask…(return to the beginning - it’s a loop that has not answers, like the song that never ends). “God Bless America…for those who can afford it.”

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